Keynote panel

Q: Motorola guy: Why should I believe that J2EE will withstand the .NET

A.Cliff: IBM

A.Mark: people may not want vendor lock-in.  People aren't putting all
their IP into .NET.  

A.Rod: projects are succeeding

A.Cliff: Band together to fight MS.  JCP.  Open Source influencing JCP.

A.Gregor Hohpe: JCP: give us your idea, Sun owns it.  MS: give us your
idea, we hire you.  It's about developer mindshare.  The stuff that is
most pervasive, is the stuff that's no-one talks about any more.  Cobol,
C++. There aren't that many Cobol conferences, but many businesses are
running their businesses on it.  People like choices, but not too mant

A.Linda: agree.  We have a competitive technology market of our own,
therefore, we have the benefit of having these technologies compete
against each other.  

A.Mark: No one does COM any more?

A.Gregor: doch.  But new development is outweighed by maintenance many
times over.  There is lots of COM out there.  MS did lose some of the VB
community with ASP.NET.  

Floyd: MS has sent out invitations to developers that are neutral to
hostile to .NET.  

Rod: there is some growth in .NET open source things.  How long will EJB
and J2EE live?

A.Dion: waiting for the next thing.  

A.Mark: Look at core of Java and MS.  Java: boundaires: JVM, libraries.
Enables independent evolution.  .NET: boundary is Windows.  Can't evolve
independently.  Personal: but can't MS just introduce this boundary?

A.Rod: MS community is very pragmatic.  Let's learn from it.  

Audience: I like SOA.  Why are you guys dissing it?

A.Gregor: It's coming, but it's not displacing.

A.Rod: SOA is coming, but slowly than it seems.  J2EE App Server is
becoming a commodity.  

Q: Does it make sense to bring in loosly typed objects directly into

A.Mark: JAXB is going to this.  

A.Cliff: Apache XMLBeans is out there.

A.Dion: EcmaScript for XML, E4X, has this.  

Q.Rod: What's happening with Groovy?

A.Dion: It's a JSR, it shouldn't be.  What else can we do on the JVM.

A.Cliff: Open source is a better venue for early collaboration than JCP,
because the vendor nature of JCP.

Q: J12004: we're going after MS developers.  It hasn't happened.  Why?

A.Gregor: Java makes people waste too much time on versionitis.

A.Mark: He thinks the component area with JSF is where we can make some

A.Rod: Tools are still not as good as MS.

Q.Nike: missing in java: the nightly batch run.  Not a lot of support
for transactionality from a batch process.  

A.Rod: Agree.  We're not giving any attention.

A.Mark: Agree.  Platform is oriented to interactive "real time" apps,
not batch apps.  

Q. Putting JSF into J2EE seems to be a marketing thing.  Will this have
a negative framework for other frameworks?

A.Cliff: Still the same.  People will choose, even if it's in J2EE.  

A.Rod: Persistence: there is some clarity in the winner.  In the web
space, not yet.  It'll be interesting to see who wins.  

A.Mark: I don't think that bundling JSF won't stop other frameworks from
existing out there.

A.Dion: Depends on the kind of app you're building.